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 New Member from CNJ

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marcar1993

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Join date : 2009-11-27

PostSubject: New Member from CNJ   Sat Nov 28, 2009 1:42 am

hi all. My name is Martin, and this is my dad's 82 Fairmont Futura that I hope to get a hold of whenever he gets a new truck...





It currently has a 200 I6 and a C5. I plan on making it considerably faster, but to what degree and how changes with the weather... Rolling Eyes
I probably want a 5 speed, but my ideas for a motor change drastically. From a hot rod 6 to a 460 (don't even know if that'll physically fit). In between being 351 and a 302...
However, first and foremost it needs some MAJOR rust repair, done correctly. I used to joke that the only part of the car not rusted was the roof, but man that bit me in the arse. because there is a small spot on the roof by the top of the windsheild. My dad sanded and painted it, hopefully that'll hold...
For the last 10+ years my dad spends 2-4 days every 6 months cutting, riviting metal in, and bondoing.
While it isn't the best repair it has slowed the cancer down considerably, by removing as much as possible and encapsulating the rest. You can see his work on the lower 1/2 of the car... That 2 tone is done with rustoleum.
All in all the car has served it's purpose well and has LONG outlasted just about every one of it's kind in these parts. My mom bought it in 86 for he first car of her OWN. In 91, when they got married they retired my dad's 76 t/a and restoration started on it. This was their joint car until 93 when my mom got a new lumina. That saved this cars life ultimatly. (Just junked the lumina this summer, destroyed beyond description, and not from any one accident).
My mother and the first owner were not the best on the car, that is for sure... But my dad has nursed it along to 186k on the original motor. The trans and rear have been redone.

I have my work cut out for me, but I really am looking forward to the end result...

-Martin
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detroitiron2000

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Join date : 2008-11-08
Age : 54
Location : Bridgman, Michigan

PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Sat Nov 28, 2009 9:22 am

Welcome Martin! Good to see someone is willing to work to save one of these cars. It looks like you've got a good place to start. These cars are great! I love mine. My first daily driver was a 1978 4 door boxtop. Loved it!

As for repairs on the body, don't sweat it. If done well it will last forever. As you already know, if not doen well, it will fall out and create bigger issues. There are guys on here doing amazing work so make sure you tap into them. Look in the pics section at the work being done in the thread titled "Sanding on the Zephyr" or something like that.

Any of the motors you listed will fit. The 429/460 willl drop in. There are kits to give you the parts needed (motor mounts, oil pan, etc.). These cars are so light though that a hot small block can really make them come alive. Mine started with a 1994 GT roller motor and T5. Ran darn strong.

Best budget builds are on 302 or 351. The advantage to the 302 is that you can build a nice one and it stays under the hood without any problems. The 351 may need a hole in the hood to fit or a dropped "K" member. When you get to this point make sure you drop in here for help, these guys have done it all.

Also, since so many Mustang parts fit you can do some really nice upgrades to the suspension, brakes, wheels, axle, etc. You can find a lot of info on these upgrades as well here.

Drop in frequently, you never know what you'll learn or teach!!

Don cheers
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z7turbo

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Age : 47
Location : Toledo, Ohio

PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Sat Nov 28, 2009 12:25 pm

Welcome from Toledo, Ohio! I think I gave Don a little itch for a bigblock...just to see how it can be done on a budget, but not neccesarilly easy, check out my post in the photos section.
http://fairmont302.aforumfree.com/photo-album-f4/my-1980-z7-turbo-t49.htm
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detroitiron2000

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Location : Bridgman, Michigan

PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Sat Nov 28, 2009 5:30 pm

An ITCH? It's a full blown RASH now! I found two really nice set ups I am investigating now! One is a 1970 429 "A" block with D0VE heads and the other is a 460 with C8 heads...I like the 429 better because of the block though.

More to come.

But enough of me!

Again, welcome aboard!
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Revolution909

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Age : 28

PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Sat Nov 28, 2009 6:30 pm

Welcome to the forum, dont be shy to make new posts, or ask questions, its slow here and we want it to get better lol.

The car looks great, looks like its in good shape too unless the bottom is full of bondo. Just needs a new front fender.Very Happy Before you get an engine and tranny decide what you want to do with it, Go fast in a straight line?, go around corners fast?, beat up on imports on the street?, get good gas millage?. All of them are do able, just if you want it to handle, you should not get a 460, but it would be a good choice if you want to go fast, in a straight line.
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HandyAndy



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Join date : 2008-12-15

PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:15 pm

Yeah those big blocks are beasts for daily drivers.
There was one fellow that put a twin turboed 460 in there but swapped it out for a modular motor.
I'm keeping my six, just had it rebuilt with a hotter cam, etc.
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z7turbo

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Age : 47
Location : Toledo, Ohio

PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Mon Nov 30, 2009 11:39 pm

Don, I'm not really big on numbers, but is the 429 "A" block a 4 bolt main block? Other than that the 429/460 share the same block. The only thing that changed over the years is the deck height. The c8 and the dove heads are the same head. c8=1968, c9=1969, dove=1970
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detroitiron2000

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PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:08 pm

The "A" block has the thicker webs of the 4 bolt but is a two bolt. The nice thing is that it is capable of taking the splayed both mains which is stronger than the 4 bolt. I had the wrong head casting numbers, they are C9VE-A.

The heads are slightly different from the D0VE based on what I've researched. They are better heads in the lower rpm range producing better low end torque, ideal for street use, due to smaller port sizes than a D0VE so they fall off in the higher rpm range.

The motor I'm looking at is a stock 385 hp and I'm told with mild porting and headers is around 430 to 440 hp.

I'm waiting for the guy to get back after being gone for Xgiving. I'll post up again then!
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z7turbo

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PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Wed Dec 02, 2009 2:23 am

Not get into a debate, but I've been messing around with these engines for a long time....here's what I know:
1968-1970 429/460 blocks have the shortest deck height @ 10.320
early 1971 had a deck of 10.321
late 1971 the deck went to 10.322
why does this matter?
ford used the same amount of material in the blocks up until the 80's
this is why the mains are beefier in the early blocks. On later blocks with taller decks, the material was taken away from the mains and added to the deck.
A friend of mine swears by running a girdle on the maincaps....far cheaper than the splayed caps... The car sees regular street duty and is well into the 9 sec zone.
Knowing these engines, and from what I've read, 4 bolt mains or girdles aren't a necessity until the 600hp range...that's when cap walk starts to become an issue.
I've actually physically looked at the C8,C9 & DOVE head and there is no difference, unless you're thinking about the cobra jet head, which has intake ports large enough to swallow a golf ball...casting #'s are DOOE-R.
I hopes this helps you out. I'd hate to see you spend cash you really didn't need to....Also there are people who prey on others who aren't as knowledgeable in certain areas....If you have any questions....shoot me a pm, or you wanna talk sometime, I'll give you my # if you want.


Last edited by z7turbo on Wed Dec 02, 2009 2:25 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : added content)
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detroitiron2000

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PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Wed Dec 02, 2009 9:44 pm

Sweet, thanks for the help! This will save me a TON of money! Shave your legs, we're going out for drinks!

pm sent

Don
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marcar1993

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PostSubject: Re: New Member from CNJ   Tue Dec 08, 2009 8:26 pm

Revolution909 wrote:


The car looks great, looks like its in good shape too unless the bottom is full of bondo. Just needs a new front fender.Very Happy Before you get an engine and tranny decide what you want to do with it, Go fast in a straight line?, go around corners fast?, beat up on imports on the street?, get good gas millage?. All of them are do able, just if you want it to handle, you should not get a 460, but it would be a good choice if you want to go fast, in a straight line.

That whole lower section is bondo'd. Sad I do however have a new fender and hood in the shed for it, just need to paint them. But if I painted them they wouldn't match, which means painting the whole car which means doing all the body work... So it'll stay that way for a while Sad
As for my plans, I want to primarily go fast in a straight line. THEN, I want to be able to turn. I'll do as much as I can for handling but handeling will not change my decisions on the motor. Wink
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